Nashpuff

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Nashpuff

Postby K_N_U_T » Mon Feb 23, 2009 1:01 pm

Here´s a new pic I´ve put on this Site today.
I hope you enjoy it.

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Re: Nashpuff

Postby drummer » Mon Feb 23, 2009 1:04 pm

nasicornis x arietans? Looks very nice!
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby Mitton » Mon Feb 23, 2009 1:05 pm

That is really pretty.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby Bushviper » Mon Feb 23, 2009 1:27 pm

That is a youngster. Do you have any details about the breeding. Which parent was which and where did they originate from?

I must be honest I attempted this in the early 90's but was unsuccessful. The mating took place but no babies were produced.

Possibly not all puff adders are the same species and these could be differnet to what we have here? Lets hope the DNA tells us something fairly soon.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby fredsmith » Mon Feb 23, 2009 2:15 pm

Nice!!!
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby K_N_U_T » Mon Feb 23, 2009 2:16 pm

Yes that´s correct. It´s a youngster from the beginning of the year.
The parent´s are 1.0 B.arietans and 0.1 B.nasicornis. Both are CB.
The nasicornis shall be originate from ghana. The arietans I don´t know. I think from the south of africa.

I only get many bad eggs and 1 living baby of this breeding BUT I´ve to say that this was the first mating for the female, too.
So I think that this one is as far as I know the only Hybrid Worldwide.

Interesting would be if the Hybrids/Babies of 1.0 nasicornis and 0.1 arietans would look different as this one.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby steve » Mon Feb 23, 2009 4:24 pm

wow man! thats awesome, snake looks really nice, my 1st time to see this. very interesting. thanks for sharing
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby Xenior1976 » Mon Feb 23, 2009 8:12 pm

Stunning, just stunning... :cool:

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Re: Nashpuff

Postby steve » Mon Feb 23, 2009 11:57 pm

I can’t help myself going back to this thread time and time again just to have another look, this animal is really extraordinary!
Any idea as to what this animal would sell for?
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby K_N_U_T » Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:15 am

Thanks everyone.

Yes this one is really cool and looks so nice/interesting. I´m curious how it would looks like in some years. Maybe it will get some little horns???
Because this is the only Hybrid I don´t want to sell it so I don´t thought about a price. But it is really interesting that Hybrid´s between B.arietans and B.nasicornis are possible because many peopley say that it is not possible.

I think that I´ll post tomorrow further pics of her.

Before some people will post some negativ views...here are some of my personal aspects about Bitis Hybrids:

- Hybrid between B. arietans x B. gabonica and B. gabonica x B. nasicornis occur in nature/wildness. I think that Hybrid´s between B.arietans and B.nasicornis in the wildness are possible, too. They occur in the same countries/areas and maybe sometimes in the same Habitat. So I think this is not complete impossible.

- They are not a bluff package. You see that these Snakes are Hybrid´s.

- The Venom composition. A bite of one of the group of the big Bitis is fatal. It doesn´t matter whether it has been a "pure" Bitis or a Hybrid bite. Anyway it´s a medical emergency.
I and some other people think that there will not develop/arise a complete new venom and the polyvalente Antivenin for the big Bitis group will fit/work out.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby steve » Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:37 am

I agree completely. You have something that’s pretty much invaluable if it is truly the 1st captive hybrid...you could pretty much name your price.
something really crazy and absurd, came to mind whilst reading through this thread...imagine breeding this nashpuff, with a gabino, you pretty much putting all the large Bitis sp into one snake! Gosh it sounds totally ridiculous but highly plausible.
Please put some updated pics up.
And thanks again for sharing this with us.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby Bushviper » Tue Feb 24, 2009 11:51 am

KNUT dont be so quick to think that the venom will automatically be neutralised by the polyvalent. I was told of someone who crossed two Echis species back in the 80's. These were from different continents (Asia and Africa) and were not expected to produce young. Some time later one of the guys got bitten. They used the SAVP echis antivenom and this did not work. They then used Indian antivenom and this did not work and the person died. The rest of the animals which they could get back were then popped into the freezer because the risk was not worth it.

I would be extra careful with this animal. I am sure that if you wanted to you could get a laboratory to test the effectiveness of the Bitis antivenoms on this baby of yours.

Steve you forgot that you have to cross the puffie with the B. rhinocerus and again with B. gabonica and then cross those with B. parviocula as well, and then the gabonica with the rhinocerus. One you have done that someone is going to have found some new species and then you have to start again.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby steve » Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:00 pm

haha yeah sorry BV I ment that in general terms.
But yeah I know exactly what you mean.
Gosh the possibilities are endless really, and I guess this particular animal proves that.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby K_N_U_T » Tue Feb 24, 2009 2:02 pm

Very intersting story about the echis. But I think that there could be some further difficulties.
As many know there exists anyway some problems with the echis complex. Many/some animals are/have been sold under wrong terms.
Of which venom of which Echis was the antivenon produced and so on?
It is known that the antivenin works fine for some Echis...and for some other it works not so fine or.
The other problem is the possible greater Variance of the Venom because of the different continents?!

Referring to the venom of the Hybrid don´t get me wrong...I don´t think that the polyvalent Antivenom will fit automatically or neutralize it to 100%. But I think that there will not arise a complete new toxin and the possibility that the known antivenin will work is high.

Testing the venom would be VERY interesting but I think that this will be to expensive or what do you think?

About your last sentence...LOL...that is correct and funny :lol:
BUT...a Hybrid of parviocula...oh know...that goes to far. ;-) But by the way...I´ve heard that maybe Hybrid between parivocula and arietans occur in the wildness.
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Re: Nashpuff

Postby K_N_U_T » Wed Feb 25, 2009 3:17 pm

Here are some further pics...

Image

Image

Image
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