Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby armata » Tue Apr 05, 2011 5:01 pm

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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby yoson10 » Sat Apr 09, 2011 6:43 am

Cobra venom seems to be unusually fast acting compared to other neurotoxic snakes...I have heard of people who had complete respiratory paralysis in like 10-20 minutes from certain cobra bites... Of course this is not the norm...but their venom is very fast acting.. Much more fast acting than say a Krait and I think Mambas to. Of course some cobras aren't neurotoxic at all but I'm talking about the ones that are.

For kraits it usually takes several hours( sometimes even 12+Hours) for you to be in big trouble as far as breathing is concerned (so you have more time to seek help and get antivenom or be put on a ventilator than for a cobra bite) but the paralysis tends to last longer.... sometimes for weeks( one account a guy was paralyzed for 28 days from a common krait bite in Sri Lanka). Not sure about Mambas.

A cape cobra is a seriously dangerous snake and thank god that it turned out alright when it could have easily not. I don't mean to be nosy but when you went unconscious...did you just suddenly black out or were their gradual neurotoxic symptoms until you went unconscious? Did you eyes drop or could you not swallow or anything? Any info would be interesting...and hope your recovery went/is going well.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby fuscusV2 » Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:33 am

In particular Cape Cobra, if I'm not mistaken, weight for weight it's the most potent of cobra venoms on the continent. A huge amount depends on the bite itself though, as with all envenomation.

I vote threads like this get stickied / copied to a special envenomation section to make it easier to look up the effects of envenomation and to offer advice/warning to those wanting to handle hots. This particular thread is great in that it shows you can be an extremely experienced handler and have a close call.

For the kids handling deadly snakes, nobody is going to look at you as a hero when you're gone, if anything they'll be upset that they didn't do enough to discourage you from handling them in the first place.

Who recalls the highly experienced handler from PE snake park who died after a puffie bite?
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby armata » Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:36 pm

The bite now one week later. The swelling has gone down nicely, the wound scabbing over nicley too.
And I feel good.

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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby Eyelash » Sat Apr 09, 2011 11:20 pm

It still looks eina !I'm just glad you are ok and it turned out for the best !

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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby fuscusV2 » Sun Apr 10, 2011 12:15 am

Sjoe, hard to believe it's a week - that wound is looking really good. How much more of the antibiotics do you have? The swelling is down nicely... that's the worst, that throbbing feeling. I hope it's the last, I wouldn't wish that on my worst enemy.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby yoson10 » Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:02 am

fuscusV2 wrote:In particular Cape Cobra, if I'm not mistaken, weight for weight it's the most potent of cobra venoms on the continent. A huge amount depends on the bite itself though, as with all envenomation.



Well their is no true way of telling which snakes are the most potent to humans on a drop for drop basis.( the mice test is NOT credible for anything other than a mouse) but from what I have read on studies of bites I would agree with that statement definitely. It is clearly a very toxic cobra by world standards( which makes it an extremely toxic snake) and can easily kill you if it gets a good bite on you.

Do (non spitting) African cobras cause necrosis?? Their really isn't all that much info/studies on bites by egyptian and cape cobras compared to various Asian cobras and the African spitters. So its hard to really learn about their bites and what they cause.. I know the spitters cause necrosis and local damage and for Asian cobras( non spitting) it depends on the type of cobra and the region of the particular type( as snake venom varies regionally even for the same exact snake) with some causing necrosis and others not.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby BOOGY » Sun Apr 10, 2011 11:13 am

Uncle I'm glad you are ok! All of the best!
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby boing » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:13 am

fuscusV2 wrote:Who recalls the highly experienced handler from PE snake park who died after a puffie bite?


That was a case of him dying from anaphylaxsis (sp??) in response to the venom. It was his second puffie bite and he was dead within 45 mins, even though he was rushed to hospital. It must also be taken into account that while he had vast experience, the way they handled the animals in those days was not very safe and it is surprising more people were not bitten.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby fuscusV2 » Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:46 am

How has handling improved in recent times? From what I hear, more amateurs are handling them without caution. Or are you particularly referring to snake parks? If the latter is the case, how has handling changed?
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby Jamster » Tue Apr 12, 2011 10:09 am

I've worked at the PE snake park from time to time and we spoke about the incident. I've got the guys name on the tip of my tongue...!!! He was handeling the puffies as always holding them up by their tails(wearing gloves) and a new male that they aquired was not used to this and when he picked it up it grabbed him. This demonstrates something that Iv'e always said...You cannot judge or simply assume the behaviour of a particular snake just by looking at how the species behaves in general...Yes you can tell whether it is an aggressive species or general behavioral characteristics, but you always treat a new or unfamiliar snake with the utmost care and respect!!!
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby boing » Tue Apr 12, 2011 11:35 am

fuscusV2 wrote:How has handling improved in recent times? From what I hear, more amateurs are handling them without caution. Or are you particularly referring to snake parks? If the latter is the case, how has handling changed?


Yes, I was specifically refering to Snake Parks. They used to have a pit full of snakes which they would pick up, sometimes more than one at a time. They wore gloves but did not use hooks. Today, we never handle our venomous animals without hooks and only staff who have had training are allowed to be involved. There must always be at least two qualified staff members present. If done as a public presentation, we ensure we have a safe environment where the public will not be in danger if something goes wrong.

James, his name was Nimrod.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby Boadicea » Tue Apr 12, 2011 11:53 am

Glad that you made it Tony. It would have been one really bad advert if you hadn't and you would have been sorely missed.

@WW: Do you have any more details on that crotalus durissus bite in Austria i.e circumstances of the bite, location of the bite etc? Also do you know if it was durissus durissus or one of the other subspecies? Did the guy die of respiratory failure or complications due to the haemotoxic component? Any more details you can provide would be most interesting
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby fuscusV2 » Tue Apr 12, 2011 12:12 pm

boing wrote:
fuscusV2 wrote:How has handling improved in recent times? From what I hear, more amateurs are handling them without caution. Or are you particularly referring to snake parks? If the latter is the case, how has handling changed?


Yes, I was specifically refering to Snake Parks. They used to have a pit full of snakes which they would pick up, sometimes more than one at a time. They wore gloves but did not use hooks. Today, we never handle our venomous animals without hooks and only staff who have had training are allowed to be involved. There must always be at least two qualified staff members present. If done as a public presentation, we ensure we have a safe environment where the public will not be in danger if something goes wrong.

James, his name was Nimrod.

Thanks for that info. I worked in EL at around that time (Reptile World), we had a pit but only ever had Boomslang and Puffies on the hot side. Always used tongs, never gloves (can't handle them properly). We never did the show fangs thing like they always did at Fitsimons - at least I never did - bad for the stress levels and good for upping your chances of a tag. It was only the boomslangs that posed interesting issues with their agility. Usually I'd lift their front third up between the tongs and hold the tail and they'd inevitably try to get to where I was holding them around the tongs, making them easier to keep in one place while you waked around.
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Re: Cape cobra bite - a long unbroken record broken.

Postby swazi » Wed Apr 13, 2011 7:45 am

Great to read you are on the mend Tony. Well done to everyone who helped you during the ordeal, you are hero's in all our eyes!
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